This is our bonus episode.
You probably remember this from past seasons.
It was one of the first places that credit card thieves and other fraudsters swapped secrets and swapped money.
And that was until the Secret Service shut it down and shut down Brett way back in 2004.
Also here today, our producers Julie Getz and Megan DeMagnus.
[00:01:03] Brett Johnson: Sure, so uh fortunately I’m not breaking the law anymore.
When you make the decision, it’s not.
Uh, and the reason is is because cybercrime, especially, is an addiction.
I never had to see the consequences of my actions.
So I profited and I didn’t have to see the consequences of my actions.
And I think that’s a lot of the reason that you see cybercrime continue to explode.
[00:02:31] Bob: So let me make a leap here.
A lot of what you’re talking about is this sort of awesome power when youre invisible.
Well, it’s a lot of power, it’s a lot of power.
Would you do good things, would you do bad things?
It turns out a lot of people would do a lot of bad things.
The name Gollum Fun, it comes from “The Lord of the Rings.”
Oddly enough, I went to university for literature, big J.R.R.
Well it can’t just be Gollum.
[00:03:40] Bob: And what does, what does Gollum mean to you?
[00:03:42] Brett Johnson: It means a lot of damage, a lot of harm.
You know it’s, it’s weird when you think about it.
So it’s, it’s, it’s this complicated character.
So excuse me, sorry about that.
[00:04:50] Brett Johnson: Yeah.
We’re going to play a quick came called “Inside the Con Artist’s Playbook.”
Here’s a very brief intro.
“My bike was stolen.
And the bartender kind of gruffly said, “No, we don’t have cameras.
He didn’t lock his bike, he deserved to have his bike stolen.
It was terrible,” and uh, and the people next to me are nodding.
Anyone’s vulnerable.”
I’m going to start with an easy one.
Unfortunately, uh my guess is that they don’t really want to date me.
What, what do they want?
[00:06:22] Brett Johnson: Well they, they are very pretty though, aren’t they?
(laugh)
[00:06:26] Bob: They are remarkably pretty, yes.
[00:06:28] Brett Johnson: They’re remarkably pretty.
Yes, and they don’t have very many friends.
It’s, so what are they looking for?
You’re looking for information, access, data, or cash.
That’s what you’re looking for.
So to get that, you have to get the potential victim to trust you.
So a friend request seems pretty innocuous.
Now, you accept the request on Facebook, what happens when you accept a friend request?
Well that lends legitimacy to that friend request.
I’ll click it.
What are they looking for?
They’re looking for ultimately one of those four things; information, access, data, or cash.
If it’s information, what can you get from someone’s Facebook profile?
[00:08:26] Bob: So, okay.
Here’s another scenario.
Let me, uh, let me intercede here by saying, don’t ever try this at home.
[00:09:10] Brett Johnson: Well they’re getting credentials is, is what they’re doing.
So what can they do at that point?
Well, they can sign onto your bank account.
You don’t know about it.
It could just be harvesting credentials.
So never do this at home.
I regretted it, and then had to run around changing all my passwords afterwards.
[00:10:26] Brett Johnson: Absolutely.
Julie, you first.
My question is, I think a lot of people right now are really concerned about bitcoin.
Can you tell us what this means for the world of fraud and bitcoin.
Are people’s money safe?
[00:10:46] Brett Johnson: Boy oh boy.
If it upsets you, I’m sorry.
That’s what bitcoin is good for right now.
That’s what it’s used for.
Now that being said, there’s a lot of investors that also invest in cryptocurrency.
And there’s a lot of people making a lot of money.
[00:12:38] Brett Johnson: Actually you’re, you’re seeing it right now.
So PII, personal information, has tripled in price because of the pandemic.
That same social and date of birth right now is $6.70.
So the price has tripled.
[00:13:35] Bob: Okay, Megan, it’s your turn now.
[00:13:36] Megan: Sure, so hi, Brett.
Nice to meet you.
So a lot of our victims or guests on our show lost a lot of money through gift cards.
So I just wanted to see if you could kind of break that down.
Why do scammers request gift cards?
[00:13:50] Brett Johnson: Well, gift cards are pretty easy.
There are several… several… there’s dozens of websites where you might sell gift card information.
Or you’re able to go to the Dark Web and sell gift card information.
So it’s very easy to launder those types of funds.
And that’s typically why you see fraudsters use gift cards.
[00:14:27] Bob: Okay, Brett.
So what I mean by that is we inherently trust our technology.
You know we trust our cellphone, we trust our laptop, our desktop computers.
We don’t understand the tech, but we inherently trust it.
We don’t verify anything.
That’s one of the reasons that scams are so successful.
We trust it without verifying it.
We have to get to the point where we’re not living in fear.
I do believe in trusting things but also verifying everything.
I think that’s the best thing that Ronald Reagan ever said, “Trust but verify.”
So that’s what I would say.
Your son is in prison.
We need the bail to get him out of prison.
You pay $500.
You go down you, you wire money with Western Union to us."
Instead of immediately doing that, start to verify it.
You know, hang up the phone.
Call your daughter, call your son.
Hey, what’s going on?
have a go at verify everything.
If you’ve got the option to’t verify it, don’t do it.
So take your time.
Pause, pause on all these things.
You don’t have to react immediately to anything that’s going on.
[00:16:19] Bob: Pause, pause, just pause.
I think that’s the best, simplest message of all.
Before you take any action when it comes to spending money or sharing information, just pause.
We’ll be back soon with all new Perfect Scam episodes.
