I guess Dad is reaching out to old friends or something.
A week later my mother calls me and says, “Something terrible has happened to your father.
you gotta talk to him right away.”
[00:00:33] Bob: Welcome back to The Perfect Scam.
Im your host, Bob Sullivan.
Have you ever felt like you were an actor in your own play or movie?
Or you have ever thought someone should make a movie out of your life?
(MUSIC SEGUE)
[00:01:15] Jerry Hsu: My name is Jerry.
I come to America in 70s.
I work as an engineer for 40 years.
I support my family; Ive been working hard and save money.
But one year after I retired, I received a phone call.
[00:01:37] Bob: Thats Jerry starring as himself in the movie.
[00:02:26] Jerry Hsu: Yeah.
[00:02:34] Bob: Wow.
[00:02:35] Bob: Hes instantly scared.
But as a Taiwanese American, a threat from the Chinese government is quite scary.
Heres Jerrys son, Jonathan.
[00:03:00] Jonathan Hsu: As an engineer, my father worked for the county.
Then when Jonathan decided to switch to NYU film school, well he supported him through that too.
He didnt say no.
And so I went for it.
(Bob-laughing) But thats what he said.
And you know, everything he said was true.
The operator tells him to call the Shanghai police right away and gives him a number.
And he put, he repeat my name, and I heard a sound in the background.
It sounds like, You are the suspect.
We want to investigate you.
[00:05:15] Bob: They accuse him of laundering money and saying bad things about the Chinese government.
None of this is true but Jerry is even more scared.
So he sends Jerry on a mission.
A simple mission just to take photos of his local bank.
Jerry needs to conduct a transaction inside the bank.
Police now think the criminal is an imposter and works at Jerry’s bank.
Jerry agrees to join in on the investigation.
So if you could send just a small amount, we’ll return it right back to you.
The best way to do that is to send it to this account number.”
[00:07:09] Bob: The transaction is recreated in the movie.
[00:07:13] (movie clip) “Uh, hi, how can I help you today?”
“Uh oh yeah.
Uh, I want to transfer money.”
“All right, well I can help you right over here.”
“Just no reason to wait in line, right?
I’m Matt, by the way.”
“Oh, my name is Jerry.”
“Nice to meet you, Jerry.
Okay, so how much money are we transferring today?”
That’s quite a, quite a bit of money.
May I ask uh, why, well what the transfer is for?"
“What kind of investment?”
“It’s a, this is real estate, a real estate investment.”
“Well congratulations.”
[00:08:02] Bob: After Jerry completes the transaction, again, the investigators complement his work.
But now they are sure the criminal is working at Jerry’s bank.
In fact, it’s the man who helped him transfer his money.
So they send Jerry back several times to send more and more money.
I see that you are here to make another wire transfer.
Uh, how much will we be transferring today?"
“$250,000.”
“$250,000.”
“That is a significant amount of money.
Ah, I might have to speak with our branch manager.
Wha–, what’s the purpose of the transfer?”
“That’s none of your business.”
[00:09:09] Bob: And that $250,000, that’s the last of the money Jerry has.
The line is dead.
Jerry calls frantically for several days, but the police never answer.
He comes to realize the police were really actors, criminals, and this movie is all too real.
Jerry is not a secret agent working for justice.
He’s a victim.
At this point, he’s transferred $980,000, all his retirement money.
And now he knows criminals have all his money.
(chuckles) Now it all gone.
Remember, his son, Jonathan, is a movie producer, and an NYU grad.
And I think nothing of it.
I’m like, oh, I guess Dad is reaching out to old friends or something.
And a week later my mother calls me and says, “Something terrible has happened to your father.
you’re gonna wanna talk to him right away.”
So when I call my father, he says, “I just lost my life savings.
I lost everything.”
I’m like, “What does everything mean?”
And he tells me, “I’ve lost a million dollars.”
I’m like, “Dad, I didn’t even know you had a million dollars.”
(chuckles) And you know he’s always kept his finances very close to his chest.
Like how could a bank let this happen?
How could we, how do we make amends?
How do we like, you know fix this?
You know that’s, that’s what I do as a producer.
But the bank says it can’t do anything.
Then the police say there’s nothing they can do.
But there is one thing Jonathan knows he can do.
And so I decide I need to record a couple interviews.
And he’s like, “Okay, let’s do it.”
And something amazing happens.
How do you know how to write a screenplay?"
So I, I always wanted to be like an actor or a playwright."
He didn’t reveal to me at that point that he had an interest at all in it.
[00:16:02] Jonathan Hsu: …fulfilling like a dream of his.
I’m like, “No, my dad wrote this.”
[00:16:20] Bob: And that leads to another obvious question.
Jonathan asks if his father will play himself in the movie.
I felt like I was on a mission and taking these pictures and wiretapping the bank tellers."
[00:16:59] Bob: More than game.
Jerry insists the movie not be a documentary.
He wants it to be a thriller.
They shoot the movie as if the Chinese police are real.
They recreate scene after scene.
They won’t tell the audience the scam until the end as part of a surprise reveal.
But it’s not easy.
[00:18:13] Bob: But filming the movie is more than a passion project.
It takes Jerry’s mind off of all that has happened.
He, he kept saying that on the interview, “I’m so stupid.”
I’m like, “No this was designed to, to happen.
And so it was therapeutic, it was educational for him.
And it was, and it was a, the whole family got behind it.
We all played ourselves a, a version of ourselves in the film.
And we got to spend a lot of time together as a family.
[00:19:36] Bob: Making the film also gave Jonathan critical insights into how organized criminals work.
It’s kind of like they’re putting on a play or acting in a movie.
And they were very convincing.
[00:20:05] Bob: I like that you describe it as a cast of characters.
[00:20:17] Jonathan Hsu: Right, yeah.
Yeah, they’re, they’re putting on a show.
[00:20:37] Bob: Jerry says making the movie really helped him.
[00:21:11] Bob: Were you happy with the movie when it came out?
[00:21:13] Jerry Hsu: Yeah, much over, I’m happy.
It’s part of my, part of my, my, my hobby too.
I want to play or write script and everything so.
[00:21:35] Jonathan Hsu: So the film industry is, is strange.
And it’s, it’s an amazing like emotional moment.
I’m like, “No, it’s not.
Like you’re just sitting…” He’s like, “But I’m showing my thighs.”
And I’m like, “Oh my God, like come on.”
He’s like, “I’m doing this for you.”
And he’s like, “I’m helping your career just so you know.”
So… (laughing)
[00:23:22] Bob: As the father who would do anything.
[00:23:23] Jerry Hsu: Yeah, I’m sacrificing my body for you.
So that brings laughs, but on a serious note, like he did.
And to him, he’s still playing the role of a father for his son.
I have to tell you, that’s beautiful.
We make light of it because it’s such a heavy subject.
[00:24:49] Jerry Hsu: No, no I never think I am a superstar.
Like out of nowhere, and we’re like, who’s this guy?
[00:25:30] Bob: (laughing) Oh, I hope that was fun.
[00:25:32] Jonathan Hsu: We were turning heads.
[00:25:33] Bob: (laughing) The movie has changed things for the whole family.
So that’s a huge victory.
It’s things could change in a day.
I’m just happy to have as much fun and spend as much time as possible with my dad.
And, and that’s all, all we can really hope for at this point.
But he figured it was worth it.
That might be true for other victims too.
[00:28:01] Bob: And it, it’s exciting.
[00:28:08] Bob: Unfortunately, the movie hasnt resulted in any additional law enforcement attention.
They are no closer to getting back Jerry’s money or catching any criminals.
But Jonathan hopes it might at least get the attention of bank officials or employees.
And yeah, that’s true.
[00:29:09] Jerry Hsu: First be, look out, be alert, okay.
Any time people call you wanting money, don’t give money.
That’s one of major characters of the scammer.
“Don’t tell anybody.”
When they say that, you know this is a scam.
For children, I need them to call them often.
Don’t say, don’t just say, “Hi, doing okay?
That’s not good.
you gotta ask details.
What’s something new, what activities you have now?”
[00:29:44] Bob: Jonathan has a similar message to share.
Like one of the big reasons they were able to hook Jerry was, they knew his address.
[00:30:53] Bob: Jerry is philosophical about everything, and really likes the extended film metaphor.
[00:31:04] Jerry Hsu: Yeah.
[00:31:05] Bob: Have you always been this philosophical?
Become father, become grandfather.
So that’s what I’m thinking.
But let’s not sugar coat the real-life story.
Jerry’s life has been forever changed by this crime.
Your father had to, had to leave the country over this, right?
That is where he wanted to live and retire to, but his retirement was cut short.
Like he didn’t have any time to spend with his grandkids, more time in America.
But all of that got cut away, and now he is in Taiwan.
But he’s, he’s on the other side of the world from his family.
Or 9 am and 10 am or 9 pm and 10.
So, so it’s like we have limited time to connect with each other.
He doesn’t get to see his grand–, grandchildren grow up the way he wanted to.
You know, so those are real concerns that we still are battling with.
[00:33:24] Bob: Still, the family has entered a new phase of life.
And, and that’s reassuring.
Now I look back and I say, why are you so worried all the time.
This will be gone.
It will be, everything will be over.
That’s, that’s my philosophy now, everything will be over.
[00:34:18] Bob: But the fun from the movie, well that’s not over yet.
[00:34:25] Jerry Hsu: I win, I’m the best actor.
[00:35:01] Bob: That’s fantastic, that’s just great.
And particularly, members of the Asian community.
[00:35:43] Bob: What does a victim advocate so?
I find out what they need.
[00:36:36] Bob: Jerry’s story was all too familiar to Alan.
Because I, I had cases that was kind of 80%, 90% like that.
The bad guys somehow, these days it’s not too hard to get someone’s personal information.
[00:36:58] Bob: Minorities face special challenges when dealing with these kinds of crimes, he said.
[00:37:03] Alan Lai: I’m a minority, I specialize in working with minority victims.
And many of them don’t understand the system in America.
Why do you gotta me to come to talk to the defense attorney?
Why do you need me to come to court to testify?”
So that’s another hard part of the job.
Then you don’t have to deal with the government.
See if the government is looking for you, that means trouble.
So they, they don’t like to deal with the government.
If you’re a law-abiding citizen, the government would not be looking for you.
But if the government looks for you, then that, that means trouble.
And, and they, they, they don’t like it.
So they, it’s a lot of time it’s just too much to worry.
[00:38:59] Bob: And there are specific reasons for Asian immigrants to worry.
The respect of human rights is not nearly as clear as in America.
And so people are fearful.
[00:39:52] Alan Lai: These bad guys can easily make fraudulent warrants.
They even made our, made up warrants from the Shanghai Court.
So it, it sounded quite real.
[00:40:50] Bob: Also as we heard in Jerry’s story, proving innocence is very important.
[00:40:55] Alan Lai: They don’t want their name to be tainted.
So the Chinese really want to protect their name uh big time.
A lot of the Asians are really protective of their reputation.
[00:41:57] Bob: So there are plenty of ways to trigger fear in a potential victim.
[00:42:02] Alan Lai: Yeah, the fear kicks in.
[00:42:29] Bob: Alan’s most important advice, have a trusted data pipe.
You, you oughta have a, a list of people.
And then if, if something happens, should doubt set in, talk to those people.
And so you, you should probably plan for the worst say, in case some fear kicks in.
[00:43:23] Alan Lai: Yeah, thank you.
They did not leave him alone.
Call the AARP Fraud Watch internet Helpline at 877-908-3360.
Their trained fraud specialists can provide you with free support and guidance on what to do next.
That address again is: theperfectscampodcast@aarp.org.
Be sure to find us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to podcasts.
For AARP’s The Perfect Scam, I’m Bob Sullivan.
As aTaiwanese immigrant, Jerry is frightened; there must be a misunderstanding.
And in this heartbreaking yet-warming film, Jerry plays himself.
