[00:00:18] Julie: Welcome back to AARP’s The Perfect Scam.
I’m your host, Julie Getz and with me today as always, Frank Abagnale.
Frank, it’s great to see you.
[00:00:25] Frank Abagnale: Great to be here, Julie.
It just won’t go away.
Why is that, Frank?
So it’s much like the IRS scam.
It is a very, very popular scam.
You pick up the phone and says, “Sergeant Ryan, we have arrested your uh grandson.
They said he didn’t want us to call his parents.
He asked us to call you.”
And of course, their immediate response is, “Well no, absolutely.
How do I do that?”
So let me, I’ll be down there in four minutes.
Let me just come down there and I’ll give you the money."
“Oh no, you might’t do that.
And again, very easy to confirm.
That’s just a, a scam.”
So again, education is a very, very important, important part of this.
[00:04:43] Julie: Okay, Frank, thanks for explaining the way this scam works.
We’ll be back in a bit to discuss the grandparent scam more.
It’s a story we learned about from Chicago reporter, Alexandria Jacobson.
[00:05:06] Alexandria Jacobson: One of the publications I freelance for is the Chicago Sun Times.
[00:05:23] Julie: And what kind of stories did you feature?
[00:05:43] In August 2018, you wrote an article about grandparent scam.
What made the Sun Times decide to focus on that particular story?
[00:06:42] Julie: Or who they thought was their grandson calling for help.
[00:06:58] Alexandria Jacobson: He said, “Your grandson is in this holding center.
We need some money to make a run at help keep him out of jail.”
I need you to send me money as soon as possible."
John told me that he and his wife felt terror when they got this phone call.
It could have been totally plausible that their grandson was in a car accident.
[00:07:31] Julie: The Allens quickly asked what they can do to bail their grandson out.
[00:07:34] Alexandria Jacobson: The person asked, “Where do you have credit cards?”
The very next day, they get another call.
(phone ring) Each one is more aggressive than the last.
[00:08:59] Julie: Fortunately the Allens have children they can count on.
One of them is Karen Allen.
She’s an Associate Director of Chicago Field Studies at Northwestern University and speaks to her parents every week.
Does he have a black eye?"
I’m like, “No, James is fine.”
I said, “Tell me what’s going on.”
[00:09:37] Julie: Karen and her parents usually have an easy conversation.
This time, they seemed to be hiding something.
It takes her at least five minutes to get them to open up.
[00:10:02] Julie: Karen immediately guesses the truth; her parents have been caught in a scam.
She tries to break it to them as gently as she can.
[00:10:09] Karen Allen: It took time for me to convince him that James was okay.
That there was no accident.
One lives in Chicago, another lives in Vermont.
They agree that the brother who lives in New York should check on the parents right away.
They went to the bank.
They changed accounts, so he then was there attending to them as best they could.
[00:10:56] Julie: Did your parents report what happened to them to the police?
[00:11:00] Karen Allen: They did.
They did venture to pursue and recoup some of their lost money via an attorney.
[00:11:45] Julie: Okay, so the scammers never got caught.
[00:11:49] Karen Allen: They did not.
[00:11:58] Karen Allen: Correct.
[00:11:59] Julie: Did the banks follow-up?
Did they ask questions?
[00:12:02] Karen Allen: No.
[00:12:31] Julie: Karen, tell me a little bit about your parents.
How would you describe their personalities?
[00:12:34] Karen Allen: My dad is very outgoing.
He’s a salesman by profession.
My mom is more reserved and private.
[00:13:51] Julie: Karen, your mom and dad sound like very caring people.
Do you think that could have helped make them open to these scammers?
So, you know, they thought it plausible that this could happen.
You know, they obviously were helping, in their mind, a grandson who was in trouble.
My dad is college educated, my mom is smart and has worked her whole life.
[00:16:03] Julie: How do you think this experience affected your parents?
[00:16:05] Karen Allen: They’re ashamed.
There’s a lot of shame, like how could I have let this happen to me?
I do think that AARP has done great things in the Bulletin, in the magazines with the tips.
I know my parents see that and read it.
I do as well.
[00:17:44] Julie: Altogether, the Allens lost $16,500 in this grandparent scam.
As I mentioned the grandparent scam is very prevalent, anyone can fall victim to it.
So the most depressing thing to me is that scammers are able to concoct such believable stories.
[00:18:29] Julie: Frank, what is the biggest takeaway from this story?
[00:18:56] Julie: And Home Depot, nonetheless.
[00:18:57] Frank: Yeah, from Home Depot or somewhere.
But in order for it to work, you had to know me one on one.
I’m just going to take some of Helen’s money.
Today youre dealing with someone thousands of miles away and they don’t see you.
You don’t see them.
So there is no compassion.
[00:20:47] Julie: So folks, be aware of the grandparent scam.
[00:21:04] Julie: Great, all right.
See you next week.
[00:21:06] Frank Abagnale: Thank you.
Be sure to find us on Apple podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to podcasts.
For AARP - The Perfect Scam, I’m Julie Getz.
END OF TRANSCRIPT
In upstate New York, an older couple receives a startling call from an unknown voice.
They are told their grandson has been in a car accident.
The caller knows their grandsons name, where he lives and other details about his life.
Terrified, the grandparents agree to cover the legal fees to get their grandson out of jail.
They follow the callers instructions and send $5,400 in gift cards.
Then the caller demands $10,000 cash.
For instance, if you are looking for a job you are more vulnerable to a work-at-home scam.
