It’s so easy tobecome a victim of one of these people.
[00:00:17] HOST:Another week, another scam.
This week, is it really the credit card companycalling?
This scam will sound familiar to many, and it’s definitely one to lookout for.
We’ll tell you what questions to ask and when to just hang up.
Frank, thanks for being here once again.
[00:00:37] FrankAbagnale: Great to be here, will, Thanks.
[00:00:58] FrankAbagnale: Right.
His actual name was Joe Shea.
[00:01:02] HOST: Oh,not his real name.
Tom Hanks did an amazing job of portraying him.
Hesounded like him, he looked like him.
[00:01:36] FrankAbagnale: Yeah, his mannerisms and everything he picked up, he was great.
JoeShea was a wonderful man.
He and I were friends for 30 some odd years.
I workedwith him a great deal at the Bureau for 10 years till he retired.
We remainedfriends 20 years after.
He had twodaughters which I’m very close to today, and he was just a wonderful, wonderfulman.
[00:02:39] HOST: Right,and there’s a father figure vibe in the movie.
[00:02:41] FrankAbagnale: Right, yeah, absolutely.
[00:02:48] FrankAbagnale: Yes.
But no, I knew eventually they’d be taking me back,yeah.
But nonetheless, you did get out of the planeand go running off the runway.
[00:03:45] FrankAbagnale: Yes.
I was nottrying to be sneaky.
I knew all the from the otherexperience.
[00:04:41] HOST:Alright, cause the average person wouldn’t go back in the galley.
I wasn’t trying to be sneaky.
I hit theground and started running to the Van Wyck Expressway.
I assumed someone in thetower saw me running, but nobody saw me.
I went over the fence.
And in a waymaybe it did.
You were a different guy, you were a kid.
[00:05:55] FrankAbagnale: A different person, yeah.
[00:05:57] HOST: Andthen 41 years later, you’re still working with the FBI.
[00:06:33] HOST:Jailhouse interviews.
You have to build credibility.People have to believe they can trust you.
It’s the samething.
[00:07:43] FrankAbagnale: Absolutely.
Theyhave to make the decision to want to do it, they want to change their life.
Youve got to work at it, butyou can do it.
(MUSIC SEGUE)
[00:08:12] HOST: Onthis week’s episode, we introduce you to Ann.
Unfortunately,one day last year Ann learned that she’s not as foolproof as she thought.
And I said, “Alright.
I’m glad you called.I appreciate it.”
And she gave me the last four of my credit card, thelast four numbers.
And I said, “Alright, that’s good.”
[00:09:19] Ann: Well,it’s a re-scam.
[00:10:18] Ann: Yes, Iwas distracted.
[00:10:40] Ann:Exactly.
She wanted to know what other credit cards we had and what mybank account number was.
[00:11:43] HOST: Andso, when you heard that what went through your mind?
[00:11:47] Ann: Wordsthat I cannot repeat in a polite society.
[00:11:52] HOST: In afamily-friendly setting.
[00:11:54] Ann: Yes,exactly.
And I was really worried.
Within 24 hours, they, the scammers had physically reproduced my debitcard for our bank account.
[00:12:19] HOST: How,how do you know they were able to do that?
At that point, I called my bank and found out that they hadcleaned us out of $5,000.
[00:12:45] HOST: GoodLord.
Andfinally, the group was caught.
We’ve never recovered that amount of money thatwe lost.
There must have been multiple copies of the debit card made, becauseit was all over the country.
And within 24 hours they had cleaned us out.
[00:14:25] HOST:Anything else you want to add?
[00:14:33] Ann: I hopeso.
[00:15:19] Ann: No, no,no.
[00:15:25] HOST: Ann, Ilike your, I like your style.
We, personally I like it.
Wereyou able to talk to your husband, a friend, your family?
A lot of people feelembarrassed when this kind of thing happens.
[00:15:44] Ann: I’m notone of those people.
[00:16:05] FrankAbagnale: That was probably just, the scammer didn’t plan on that.
[00:16:36] HOST: Andthey’re creating the credit cards like that.
[00:16:37] FrankAbagnale: And they’re creating the credit cards, yes.
So there’s a couple ofthings here.
First of all, they’re probably a Russian gang.
They would havebeen a little more sophisticated today and they would have popped up as WellsFargo bank.
They would have said yes, there was suspicious activity on youraccount, we’re from the fraud department.
That’s on everything; department store charges, everywhere.
And today we do have chips in cards.
Thewhole purpose of the chip is to keep cards from being cloned.
That’s the solepurpose behind the chip on the card.
It’s veryeffective in keeping people from cloning cards as they did in this case.
[00:18:13] HOST: Butisn’t the chip very secure?
[00:18:15] FrankAbagnale: The chip is secure, but again you have Russian gangs.
When you have20 billion dollars it’s possible for you to produce your own chips.
[00:18:36] HOST: So youswipe it.
[00:18:36] FrankAbagnale: They tell you to swipe it.
So they just circumvent the chip.
[00:18:39] HOST: Andhalf those machines don’t have the pin technology in them anyway, right?
[00:19:03] FrankAbagnale: Right, and there’s a lot to be said about 4-digit numbers.
And you go, “Ohyeah I’m born and raised in Alabama.”
“Oh, really?
You know you soundlike you’re my age.
I’m 41.”
No, I’m actually a littleolder than you, I’m 58."
You just told him where you were born and yourdate of birth.
Then that leaves me just two digits tomanipulate.
[00:19:46] HOST: You’rereally good at that, by the way, Frank.
[00:20:14] HOST: Soyou’ve got the first three and the last four.
[00:20:20] HOST: Thereyou go.
So, that gadget, that technology’s being used now toeliminate passwords.
So government organizations and financial institutions aregetting rid of passwords.
So let’s take a major, let’s take one of the top 10banks in the United States.
Passwords are stagnant, they need to be gone, so Trusonabasically does away with the need for passwords.
[00:21:35] HOST: Whatis somebody’s got my phone?
You don’t need to getthere through passwords and all of that.
So what will happen, I think, is you won’tneed to say your social security number anymore.
[00:22:41] HOST: Anddoes that lead into biometrics as well?
I mean movies we’ve seen for decades,right?
Eyeball scan, iris scan.
You’re you and I can’t do anything about that.
[00:23:28] HOST:Really.
[00:23:28] FrankAbagnale: So that…
[00:23:29] HOST: Andalso all teenagers stop listening.
Sobiometrics is something that can be replicated, it can be picked up and reusedagain.
[00:24:15] HOST: Whatabout the iris scan?
Is that something that’s…
[00:24:18] FrankAbagnale: Same thing.
you’re free to, once I record it, I can do a replay.
[00:24:44] FrankAbagnale: Right.
[00:24:44] HOST: Ornon-replayable.
[00:24:45] FrankAbagnale: Right.
That’s mainly more for online.
And that’s theother thing you oughta understand.
However, that does not stop onlinefraud.
So when I go buy something on Amazon, they don’t have my card.
Theydon’t have my three-digit number.
[00:25:57] FrankAbagnale: They have some.
[00:25:59] HOST: Willthat help law enforcement?
[00:26:04] HOST:Passports, too.
[00:26:06] FrankAbagnale: Yeah, passport’s much more sophisticated than driver’s license.
Theyhave a lot what we call overt and covert features.
[00:26:28] FrankAbagnale: Yeah…
[00:26:29] HOST: Whynot?
Had somesuspicious activity on your credit card."
I might listen to what they say.What is the suspicious activity?
This is what they said."
They’re not going to ask you to revealyour bank account number.
So they’re not going to ask you thatinformation.
Obviously, if they’re asking you that, they’re trying to get thatinformation from you.
Julie, how areyou?
[00:27:39] Julie: I’mwell, thank you.
[00:27:45] Julie: Yes,I do.
Always asksfor my credit card information.
I give it to her.
She asks me expiration.
Andthen she asks me the three digit on the back of the card.
I always give it, butI always pause and think, is this right?
So tell me, what advice you have.Should I be doing this?
That’s all they’rerequired to get.
Otherwise you don’t need your three digitnumber on there.
[00:30:29] FrankAbagnale: Yes.
[00:30:30] HOST: Gotit, Julie?
It’s Julie, I order every Friday.
[00:30:43] Julie: I’mso hungry, just bring me my pizza.
[00:30:51] HOST: Wedon’t know any better maybe, but right.
Any other questions or youregood?
[00:30:56] Julie: I’mgood.
[00:30:56] HOST: Okay.We should have Julie on more.
Alright, thank you, Frank.
Once again, the AARPFraud Watch data pipe Ambassador and my cohost, Frank Abagnale.
[00:31:04] FrankAbagnale: Thank you.
[00:31:04] HOST: Formore information and resources on how to protect yourself from scam artistsvisit AARP.org.
END OF TRANSCRIPT
Ann was the victim of something called a re-scam.
By the time she realized it was a scam, it was already too late.
The scammer used the information she provided to steal thousands of dollars from Anns bank account.
